McRuffian!

44 CommentsGuest E-vangies, PERSECUTED!

I got a panicked voice mail not too long ago from Val Scott, the only guy I know who had the guts to preach inside an IN N’ OUT Burger restaurant.This time something violent happened as he savored his Egg McMuffin….

After preaching at the DMV this morning I went to breakfast with my friend and I passed out Gospel tracts throughout McDonalds. This guy came up from behind me and he ripped the tract up and threw it in my face, pushed me, and cussed me out—I thought he was going to slam me! Everybody in the restaurant thought he was going to do something—they were all trippin’ out ’cause he shouted at the top of his lungs at me in the restaurant with cussing and stuff.

So, there was some cool persecution this morning, my brother; I’m still shaken by it. I thought I’d call and share it with you. It’s a blessing!

Comments (44)

  1. Dennis Liebregt

    Reply

    Hey Val
    Guess you hit a nerve with that tract you handed out huh?
    Glad you are ok and that this crazy guy didn’t do anything more than what he did. Yikes.
    Praise God for using sinners like us to proclaim the good news even when people out there don’t want anything to do with our Lord Jesus Christ. God Bless you man. Keep up the good work! I will be praying for this angry guy that God would get a hold of him and lead him to a place of repentance. Wow – first Carol and now Val – you guys are sure getting all the action. Can’t wait to hit the streets again!

  2. ExPatMatt

    Reply

    Was the gentleman escorted from the premises for his antisocial behaviour? I hope so.

  3. Nohm

    Reply

    I don’t think I’ll ever understand the mindset that thinks that (ahem) “persecution” (c’mon, really?) is “cool”.

  5. Steve Sanchez

    Reply

    Persecution isn’t cool, but it validates the fact that what Christ said was true (not that we/He needs validation): “All men will hate on account of me.”

    We are also in league, albeit to a lot lesser degree, with the early disciples, who were also persecuted for their their Christian beliefs.

    It will not be so “cool” when Christians start losing their lives….

  6. BathTub

    Reply

    Haha before I saw your response I wrote earlier over at the forums….

    “It almost perfectly highlights a previous comment about “Persecution therefore Jesus” so anything negative almost instantly becomes “Persecution!!!””

    A classic example.

  7. Steve Sanchez

    Reply

    Also, this is why any Christian would consider persecution, large or small, a blessing:

    Matthew 5: 10-12

    Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness,
    for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

    11″Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

  8. BathTub

    Reply

    Yes congrats on working out the oh so subtle hints I was giving.

    Remember the point was the hilarious nature of Val having some Cool Persecution.

  9. ZooKeeper Kevin

    Reply

    Glad you posted the passages from Matthew to explain to Nohm what you meant. I don’t think any of us axtively seeks that kind of persecution (or worse) when we share the Gospel, but according to Scripture, like you wrote, it is a blessing. Thanks for sharing the story !!

  10. ExPatMatt

    Reply

    Steve,

    “11″Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.”

    I’ve bolded the bit I’m having trouble with. It seems like a lot of the time, American Christians are ‘persecuted’ not for what they say (the Gospel), but for how they say it (annoyingly loud and obnoxious). This is not being persecuted because of Christ, it’s being taken down a peg for making a scene.

    Plus, if someone tells you you’re being a jerk…and you are actually being a jerk then they’re not saying anything ‘falsely’ against you, are they?

    Christians in China and the middle east who get beaten, evicted, imprisoned and killed for trying to preach the Gospel are being persecuted – no doubt at all. American Christians…not so much.

    Once again, I am in no way condoning or making excuses for the gentleman’s behaviour – it was clearly out of order.

    Cheers,

  11. Matt Becker

    Reply

    Could be the man was under some sort of demonic influence to become so enraged. Usually most of the “lost” are so dead that they are indifferent to someone preaching the Word of God. They might become annoyed or irritated but not enraged like that. I often used to wonder about the Gospels where demon possessed were coming out of the wood works (so it would seem) where ever Jesus went or later when the Apostles would preach. Val, just an idea, but next time that should ever happen to you again shout “Stop, in the name of Jesus.” Even the demons must obey his name!

  12. Steve Sanchez

    Reply

    To BathTub: Yeah, bad choice of words on Val’s part. Persecution is never cool.

    To EPM: You are correct on all counts except the description of the angry man as a “gentleman.”

    To Matt: I’ve actually done that one or two times.

    When I was a new Christian, a guy came at us with a crossbow, loaded up and bearing down. He was very angry because we were moving his live-in girlfriend out on the sly because this guy was a maniac. He surprised us by showing up unexpectedly, grabbed the crossbow, started to aim it at us, then I reached out my hand and shouted, “In the name of Jesus—STOP! He dropped the crossbow, had a minor heart attack, then we got the heck out of there.

    A few years later the guy became a Christian and… married the live in girlfriend! Seriously!!!

  13. Richard Chavarria

    Reply

    I had always thought that such eateries were very easy to hand out gospel tracts (Million Dollar Bills). I simply say something like next meal is on me and most folks smile and laugh or say nothing at all. From now on when I pass out tracts in eateries I’ll think of what happened to my brother.

    Some strange stuff happens at McDees. Hopefully, those that saw the way you conducted yourself in the face of this incident will take note. And consider what is written in the literature. Jesus Christ, our Lord who is and was and is to come. The one that predicted his death and resurrection. The one upon all hope is found. To him be glory and honor.

    For those who don’t know Val. He’s not a little man. He could have easily defended himself.

    By the way Val, why are you eating at fast food places??

    Richard

  14. Val

    Reply

    Why eat fast food? It’s like you said, I’m not a little man. LOL!!!

    Really it shook me up because it was quiet in there until this guy was screaming in my face. I felt the rush of blood that happens when you know you may have to defend yourself. The memory of the torn up million pieces hitting me in the face is the cool part. We all pass out so many of these millions, it is good to be re-assured once in a while that the message really works getting sinners to see their sin.

    That’s all we’re doing is helping people who are in self denial see their need for God.

  15. Thomas Moore

    Reply

    Wow! This made me think of the time (just a few weeks ago) when I put a tract in a guy’s car before going into Long John Silvers. He must have saw me do it. After getting in his car he came back into the resturant with the tract and handed back to me saying that he was a pagan and didn’t want it. I’ve never had anybody do that before. Keep it up Val!!! I have handed out tracts from time too time in resturants but it is hard for me! Your an inspiration to do this more often really in my opinion. Preach on!!!

    Thomas Moore

  16. ExPatMatt

    Reply

    Thomas,

    You put a tract into someone’s car? Don’t you think that’s a little invasive?

    Cheers,

  17. Richard Chavarria

    Reply

    God is invasive. He will come up the unrepentant by the power of his awesome wrath that will cause men to wish they had never seen the light of day. God is Holy and wicked will not stand on the day of judgement. Repent while there is still time. Who would be so crazy as to say he would die and then rise from the dead. Yet, this is exactly what Christ did. And was seen by over 500 people before he ascended in heaven. This fact turned the world upside down by men who had previously cowarded away. What could cause these men and women to do such a thing had not Christ rose from the dead.

  18. ExPatMatt

    Reply

    Richard,

    “God is invasive.”

    Are you of the opinion that Thomas is God? Because it wasn’t God that put that tract into some guy’s car, it was Thomas. I assume you’re not of that opinion, so what gives Thomas the right to put something in some stranger’s car?

    What, just because Thomas believes he’s doing God’s work means he doesn’t have to respect people’s property? How about if he walked into someone’s house and left a tract under their pillow, would that be cool too?

    What if a Muslim – in the sincere belief that he was doing the will of Allah – decided he wanted to leave a package of Islamic materials (in an unmarked box, perhaps) in your car; would that be ok with you?

    “God is Holy and wicked will not stand on the day of judgement.”

    Wicked? Is that really the word you were after?

    “Who would be so crazy as to say he would die and then rise from the dead.”

    How do you know He said this?

    “Yet, this is exactly what Christ did.”

    How do you know He did this?

    “And was seen by over 500 people before he ascended in heaven.”

    How do you know He was seen by 500 people? Do you have their accounts of this event?

    “This fact turned the world upside down by men who had previously cowarded away. What could cause these men and women to do such a thing had not Christ rose from the dead.”

    Blind faith?

    Cheers,

    PS. Thomas, I’d still like to hear from you about the tract-into-a-car thing.

  19. Nohm

    Reply

    Richard,

    And what does that have to do with interacting with the inside of a stranger’s car? How would you feel if other people were dropping fliers in your car’s windows?

    Don’t you see something wrong with this?

    Lastly, having watched videos of you, Richard, I’m aware that you believe what you wrote above… but why should I? It’s a bunch of assertions that end with argumentum ad ignorantiam (i.e., the “what could cause” question).

  21. Steve Sanchez

    Reply

    Hey Richard, good job as always. Don’t let those big bad atheists guys scare you. Continue to be faithful! They can read the Bible for themselves and believe… or not!

    Again, thanks for being faithful!

  22. Nohm

    Reply

    “Don’t let those big bad atheists guys scare you.”

    For the record, I am in no way shape or form trying to “scare” Richard. I don’t see the point in doing so.

  23. ExPatMatt

    Reply

    My either. I would like a reasonable answer from Thomas and/or Richard though.

    Is that too much to ask?

  25. Thomas Moore

    Reply

    Hey ExPatMatt, I have been putting tracts into cars (the windows are usely down slightly or all the way) for sometime now. I don’t see any problem with that. It is not hurting anything. If the person has their windows rolled up, then it wouldn’t happen. Though there are times when I put tracts on windshields too. It is a way I witness from time too time. It is not the best way but it is better than doing nothing at all. I hope that answers your question or questions. Thanks ExPatMatt

    -Thomas

  26. ExPatMatt

    Reply

    Thomas,

    I’ve been putting Islamic tracts under people’s bed-pillows (people usually leave their doors unlocked in my neighbourhood) for some time now. I don’t see any problem with that. It is not hurting anyone. If the person had their front door locked then it wouldn’t happen. There are times when I put the tracts on their front door instead, but I’d rather walk into their house and put it under their pillow instead.

    You are invading people’s privacy and their property without their consent. It’s disgusting and you should be ashamed of yourself for your arrogance and lack of respect.

    I am actually shocked that you think this is acceptable behaviour!

    *walks away shaking head in disbelief*

    • Steve Sanchez

      Reply

      Thomas: Good job! Keep it up.

      ExPatMatt (and his ilk) enjoy trolling Christian sites to discourage the faithful. (But anyone with a small sense of discernment has already gathered that.)

  27. ExPatMatt

    Reply

    Don’t be an ass, Steve.

    If you think I’m trolling and adding nothing of value to this blog then ask me to leave; I will. But don’t come at me with this passive-aggressive BS whilst totally ignoring the very reasonable point that I was making (that it’s not ok to invade someone’s privacy/property without their knowledge or consent just because you ‘believe’ you’re doing God’s will).

    I’m not trying to (nor do I think I could) ‘discourage the faithful’, I’m asking questions that you really should be asking of yourselves anyway. Unfortunately, introspection, self-criticism and integrity appear to be severely lacking in the circles you move in.

  28. Nohm

    Reply

    Steve,

    Do you honestly see NOTHING wrong with putting stuff into a stranger’s open car window?

    Look, I think Matt has made it abundantly clear that he has no problem with your evangelistic techniques, as long as you respect other people’s property and their personal space, which is about as close to “no duh” as you can get.

    Discourage the faithful? Do you REALLY think that’s our goal?

    If you do, then this banging my head on my desk won’t go to waste.

    Have you seriously missed all of the times when Matt said he supports your right to evangelize? Where he condemned the people who would physically assault you or other evangelists?

    I’m at a loss here.

  29. Thomas Moore

    Reply

    Pastor Steve- Thank you for your encouragement it is always a good thing to hear once and awhile. I enjoyed having you as my teacher at the Ambassator’s Academy back in September of 2008. I was the one you help up on a concert trash bin to do some stoplight preaching, only to have the L.A. police pull up and tell me to get down! Also I was with you with Mick Stockwell when he open-aired to the surfers down below! That was awesome!! God Bless you and your ministry!

    ExPatMatt- I’m sorry to say but your analogy is just not the same thing at all. There is a big difference between a person’s car and their home. And I would (if I was going door to door) put a tract on their front door for them to have. Solicitors do that all the time! It is clear that you have a problem not so much in the motives but in the message. Praying for your repentance and salvation in Jesus Christ! God bless you!

  30. Weemaryanne

    Reply

    Anyone with any discernment has probably noticed Steve is a passive-aggressive little nutless wonder who owes EPM an apology.

  31. Steve Sanchez

    Reply

    EPM: I think you add a lot of value. I enjoy the whole lot of you. It’s just this comment that I found to be a bit ridiculous, given your usual reasonableness:

    Thomas,

    I’ve been putting Islamic tracts under people’s bed-pillows (people usually leave their doors unlocked in my neighbourhood) for some time now. I don’t see any problem with that. It is not hurting anyone. If the person had their front door locked then it wouldn’t happen. There are times when I put the tracts on their front door instead, but I’d rather walk into their house and put it under their pillow instead.

    You are invading people’s privacy and their property without their consent. It’s disgusting and you should be ashamed of yourself for your arrogance and lack of respect.

    I am actually shocked that you think this is acceptable behaviour!

    *walks away shaking head in disbelief*

  32. Nohm

    Reply

    Thomas, like others here, tried to exert his (non-existing) mind-reading powers when he wrote: “It is clear that you have a problem not so much in the motives but in the message.”

    How is that in any way “clear”?

    I think Matt made it very clear that the opposite is true, as it is for me:

    We have NO PROBLEM with the message. I repeat, the message DOES NOT BOTHER US.

    It is the METHODS used, such as not respecting other people’s property or personal space (stuff that I learned back in kindergarten), that bothers us.

    Now, Thomas, you can try to do the mind-reading thing and tell us what you think we really think, but that’s just silly.

    I repeat: the message is fine, but some of the methods are not.

    For example, do you think the cops asked you off of the trash can because they don’t like Jesus, or maybe, just maybe, because you were engaging in an activity that might damage public property?

  33. Nohm

    Reply

    Steve,

    Why exactly do you feel that EPM’s comment was ridiculous?

    I take it that we all agree that putting someting in a stranger’s house without being invited is invading their privacy, and is therefore wrong. Correct?

    So then, why is putting something in a stranger’s car, without being invited, ok?

    Lastly, Thomas wrote: “There is a big difference between a person’s car and their home.”

    Please explain exactly what that “big difference” is, and how it applies to this conversation.

    Thank you.

    • Steve Sanchez

      Reply

      Well, going into someone’s home uninvited is a far cry from dropping a soul-saving, cool, million dollar bill Gospel tract into someone’s car. That’s how I look at it. And there is a big difference between someone’s car and their home, unless, of course, their car is their home. In that case, I would knock first on the driver’s side window before dropping something in, like a cool, soul-saving million dollar bill Gospel tract.

      Thanks! We’ll have to agree to disagree on this one.

  34. perdita

    Reply

    Well, going into someone’s home uninvited is a far cry from dropping a soul-saving, cool, million dollar bill Gospel tract into someone’s car. That’s how I look at it

    Since it’s not your car you should be looking at it from the standpoint of the car’s owner. Seriously, why does an open window make a car interior public space?

    Since the tract itself is not soul-saving (only your God can do that, remember?), why cross into personal space when you can just leave it on the windscreen? Why be a jerk about it?

  37. Nohm

    Reply

    Steve,

    Do you view it as ok because it’s a gospel tract, or because it’s a car?

    In other words, if you were walking by someone’s house, and they left the door open a little bit (let’s say they’re moving furniture or something like that), would you feel it’s ok to toss a gospel tract inside, through the partially-open door?

    Would you feel that it’s ok for someone to do that to you, if it was not a gospel tract (or maybe a JW or Mormon tract)?

    This is now just for my own curiosity; I understand that we’re agreeing to disagree here.

  38. Thomas Moore

    Reply

    Nohm- Thank you for your comments. It is more than just a passing assumption that I came to the conclusion that you do not like so much the motives, but the message. Jesus said we will know people by their fruits or actions and in this case words. Now this is never a 100% indicator of a person’s heart but it is still a valid way to tell where someone is with the Lord. Otherwise Jesus would have never taught about judging people by their fruits. From your words in pervious replys I came to the conclusion that you are an unbeliever. Again Jesus made it clear that there is a right way to judge (words and deeds) and a wrong way to judge (the way someone looks for example). Having said all this I stand corrected with you that it is not the message but the motives. So I ask you Nohm what would be the best way going about preaching the Good News or the Gospel of Jesus Christ? Also I would like to say that your final comment about the L.A. police asking me to get down is a valid statement for that situation. God bless!

    -Thomas

  39. Steve Sanchez

    Reply

    To ExPatMatt: I’m sad that you will not be commenting here anymore. I’ve enjoyed your insights and humor.

    You are welcome back anytime, my friend. Sorry that you didn’t like the fact that I don’t agree with you.

  40. Steve Sanchez

    Reply

    To Nohm:

    (Steve’s answers are in bold.)

    You wrote: Do you view it as ok because it’s a gospel tract, or because it’s a car? Both!

    In other words, if you were walking by someone’s house, and they left the door open a little bit (let’s say they’re moving furniture or something like that), would you feel it’s ok to toss a gospel tract inside, through the partially-open door? Yes.

    Would you feel that it’s ok for someone to do that to you, if it was not a gospel tract (or maybe a JW or Mormon tract)? Of course. I may not like it, though. I get flyers all the time and throw them out. They’re stuck to my fence or layed on the ground, etc.

    This is now just for my own curiosity; I understand that we’re agreeing to disagree here.

  41. Sydney

    Reply

    This was encouraging to me actually…I needed to read this. It’s inspired me to keep going out there and keep spreading the news. God bless!

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