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Joker’s Wild: The Interview

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It probably won’t surprise you at all that this Joker is an atheist. Apart from the fact that he didn’t like  evangelists “screaming” at people in front of Grauman’s Chinese Theater, that he thought we were brainwashed, that he didn’t believe in God (though he believed in Jesus), and that there was no Hell (but there was a Heaven), this Joker was quite reasonable to chat with. You be the judge. Does he make some valid points? If video doesn’t play, click here to see it.


(Filmed and edited by Peter Johnson)

16 Comments

  1. Great video!
    Well done guys.
    Praying for the “jokers” out there in Hollywood that they would come to a place of repentance and truly KNOW Jesus to be Lord and Savior.

  2. Wait, let me get this straight…

    Steve, you were asking someone else to put themselves in your shoes, and to try to see things as you see them?

    “Why do you think it’s so important to us to preach this message to these people at this amount of [sic] time?”

    Mind extending the same courtesy to us non-believers at some point?

  3. Steve, my point has nothing to do with you answering questions.

    My point has to do with you asking someone to see things from your point of view, when you rarely afford us the same.

    And when you do, you tell us what our point of view is, in a really distorted caricature.

    When you describe what you think evolution is, you present a really distorted caricature that of course sounds absurd.

    In short, my problem isn’t with you answering questions; my problem is that you rarely ask questions. When you do, we’ll respond, but then I rarely hear anything back from you, to show that you understand my answer.

    For example, you asked me why I accept the theory of evolution*. I answered that it’s because the math works. You then… well, that was it.

    Lastly, on the issue of you answering questions, one at a time or otherwise, I mentioned that you can scroll back up through a comment thread. I try to separate my questions from the rest of the text.

    But I’ll limit it to one right now: what’s your opinion on my answer that “the math works” to your “why do you accept the theory of evolution”* question?

    *I’m phrasing that in the way I would write it.

  4. Nohm, I’m glad that you see that the numbers add up. Still, as I answered in a previous post, it conflicts with the account as presented in Genesis 1. Not only is abiogenesis presented, but the creation of everything, fully formed. (Of course I do believe that the various species of a particular group can evolve, that is, cats beget other types of cats, dogs, dogs, etc. This is what I–we, Christians, refer to as micro-evolution.)

    Everything.

    Read this again: And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky.” 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth.” 23 And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

    24 And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind.” And it was so.

    And it was so.

    So, regardless of whether the “numbers work,” this is the truth I believe. It makes more sense to me.

    You choose your truth, I’ll choose mine.

    But they both can’t be right.

  5. great interview!

    i was wondering if you can take a picture of the celebrity board you had on display in this video. could you post it here on your blog?i sure would like to improve on the one i have.

    thanks!

  6. Nohm,

    You explained your concerns pretty well:

    “My point has to do with you asking someone to see things from your point of view, when you rarely afford us the same.

    “And when you do, you tell us what our point of view is, in a really distorted caricature.”

    Before I became a Christian, I had certain beliefs–agnosticism, evolutionism, “feminism,” etc. When I turned to Christ, my entire belief system changed. Many of my foundational beliefs did a 180. Some of my beliefs remain the same, but the reasons I hold those beliefs have changed. And some of my beliefs have not changed, which may or may not be a good thing.

    A person who has never undergone such a transformation remains on one side of a philosophical divide, and often has difficulty seeing the other side. A person who has a radically changed point of view often can see both sides of the issues involved. But because of the new point of view, the old point of view can look pretty hokey.

    Many times Christians will look back at their life before Christ, and go, “Ewww, I believed that?! I did that?!” because they see things so differently now. The more a Christian understands the Bible, and understands God’s holiness, goodness, mercy, etc., the worse the Christian’s sins, both past and present, may appear to him. The once-cherished beliefs of the past may appear ludicrous as well.

    As Isaiah 64:6 says, “All our righteousnesses are as filthy rags.”

    So it could be that Steve really does understand your point of view, has already seen life from your point of view, and has repudiated that point of view in his own life. It’s not that he doesn’t like YOU, but he may see in you a belief system similar to what he once believed, and now despises. And yes, he would like to talk you out of it.

  7. So it’s obvious that most people would go to Hell if the bible was true. What reason is there for believing the bible is true? Just because it refers to certain people and places that existed at one time does not mean that all of the stories accounting supernatural events and all of the supernatural concepts are true.

    Quick question about Noah and the flood: if this global flood happened thousands of years ago and is the explanation for certain phenomena explained by evolution and geology, then why are the sedimentary layers arranged how they are? Why are older ones below younger ones with fossils running through them in an order that makes evolutionary sense? If there was a global flood that killed all of the animals that weren’t on the Ark then shouldn’t there be an area of strata that contains many fossils of many different species of animals that, according to evolutionary theory, didn’t exist at the same time (since God supposedly created every “kind” of animal in full form at creation)? If such a thing existed then that would be true evidence of a global flood and evidence against evolutionary theory, but we don’t find such a thing. If there was a global flood that occurred in Earth’s recent history then we should be able to find evidence that it happened. Where’s the evidence?

    If the bible is full of BS like this then what reason is there to believe it?

  8. To Steve,

    If God created all of the major “kinds” of animals then why don’t we find their fossils in earlier geological strata? If the cat “kind” has existed since creation then we should find their fossils scattered throughout many different layers of strata, not emerging from ancestors with similar traits. Why do all of the fossils found in their particular strata make evolutionary sense and no sense with regards to the creation myth?

    You’re absolutely correct that they both can’t be right. When one is supported by all of the evidence and has never been falsified while the other one has ZERO evidence and goes contrary to current scientific understanding then which one is most likely true?

  9. Hi KarenH,

    You wrote: “Many times Christians will look back at their life before Christ, and go, “Ewww, I believed that?! I did that?!” because they see things so differently now.

    If that’s what I saw from Steve, that would be one thing. My issue isn’t that he thinks that evolution is absurd; my issue is that he thinks it’s absurd because he doesn’t know what the theory of evolution is, and that’s the difference.

    As an aside, I would also question anyone who uses the word “evolutionism” whether or not they ever actually understood the word “evolution”.

    Now, I’m not saying that people have to understand what evolution is. I’m just saying that if someone says that it’s absurd, while displaying no understanding of the theory whatsoever, it becomes difficult to take it seriously.

    So it could be that Steve really does understand your point of view, has already seen life from your point of view, and has repudiated that point of view in his own life.

    In this case, no, because he can’t verbalize our point of view in any way that makes sense to us.

    If I said that I used to be a Christian and went to synagogue every Friday for services, where we would scream out our prayers to the two imams at the front, while believing in the trinity: God, Moses, and Abraham.

    Wouldn’t you question whether or not I had ever even entered a Christian church? Because what I just wrote would make no sense to your point of view, as a Christian, right?

    It’s not that he doesn’t like YOU,

    Steve already thinks that I’m lying when I say that I don’t believe, so whether or not he likes me is irrelevant to me now. Why someone who actually believes in God would say that he didn’t, AND write multiple comments about his non-belief, makes no sense to me.

    but he may see in you a belief system similar to what he once believed,

    I honestly don’t think that this is the case at all. I have yet to see Steve write anything that makes me think that he ever thought like I do. In fact, I think the very opposite… if Steve was ever a non-believer (and I don’t think he really ever was), then his experiences and point of view during that time are sharply different from my own.

    and now despises.

    I think we can all agree on this point.

    And yes, he would like to talk you out of it.

    This is perfectly fair. He even claims that he has the “silver bullet”… a guaranteed way to make an atheist backslide. Yet he’s never used it on me or any of the other atheists at this site.

    Basically, KarenH, if someone claims to have once had a certain point of view, a point of view that you now hold, but verbalizes it in a way that makes absolutely no sense to people who hold the point of view, do you believe that the person ever actually held that view? Some examples, like evolution, are more obvious than others, as the theory has definitive claims that it makes.

  10. Abiogenesis defined: How life begins.

    Evolution defined: How life diversifies after there is life.

    Did I get it right, Nohm?

  11. You have the most basic layman definitions of those terms correct now, yes.

    The details are next, of course.

  12. “Abiogenesis defined: How life begins.

    Evolution defined: How life diversifies after there is life.

    Did I get it right, Nohm?”

    And the Oscar for most improved understanding of basic scientific terminology goes to…….

    🙂

  13. The problem of most Christians is that they fail to be like Christ. Christ didn’t go around acting better than other people. He spoke in love and did His best to explain it in a way they would understand. From what I’ve seen on here, your approach is to say, “Believe in God, or go to hell”. You act aggressive and bull-headed. Jesus didn’t come to condemn the world. Here would be my approach: “Okay, there’s a man walking in the direction of a cliff. You see the path he is headed and say, ‘Hey, mister. You’re going in the wrong direction. A cliff lies ahead and you’ll perish. Follow me and live.’ The man either listens or doesn’t. Now, was I wrong to warn the man? The answer is no. The same goes for when I tell people about Jesus. I’m doing it out of love and concern for the person. I’m not saying, ‘Hey, you idiot! If you keep going that way, you’ll die. Follow me. I’M going the right way.’ As Jesus loved us; so we must love one another.” Do you understand?

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