Good News: Bible Study Ruled…Legal!

Nov 29, 2011Steve Sanchez24 CommentsGood News

Several weeks ago I posted an article about a couple whose home Bible study was shut down by the city of San Juan Capistrano over First Amendment issues. Here’s the rest of the story….

A California court case that drew national attention was settled late last week. The city of San Juan Capistrano agreed to pay back the $300 it had fined a couple hosting a popular Bible study in their home and amend a city ordinance requiring them to get a permit. Click here to read the rest of this great news!

Comments (24)

Richard Chavarria
November 29, 2011
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This is good news for all concerned. I wish they do get to the point that there would be 50 cars coming to a weekly neighborhood Bible study. God is awesome and prayer works.
- fundianna jones
  December 1, 2011
  Reply
  Amen Richard.
  Any time someone gains a victory over the dark designs of the atheist army we should celebrate.
  I hope that they put the 300 dollars to good use by buying some tracts or supporting their local street preacher with a generous donation.
Hayzoose
November 30, 2011
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I can’t recall all the details, but was it ever said that “Bible study” was illegal? Wasn’t it more about the parking and the number of people involved?
Quasar
November 30, 2011
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Yay! It’s good to see the exact letter of the law is being upheld over common decency towards thy neighbours. I’ll bet this show of christian humility has won many hearts and minds in that neighbourhood. They were probably converted by reading the inspiring bumper stickers on the SUV’s blocking their driveways.
Thanks for the wonderful news, Steve.
Richard Chavarria
November 30, 2011
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Do atheists have a moral grounding? If there is no God, as atheists contend, what difference does it make if Christians want to: meet, to give thanks, break bread, share what God is doing in their lives and read the Bible. Really, why should an atheist care what happens? If atheism is right, then in the end it just doesn’t matter. It would seem to me that the atheist’s mantra should be “Live for today for tomorrow we die.”
Seems to me that the atheists should be the happiest people on earth because they know better than to get upset about a few 50 cars parking in the neighborhood once every weekday night.
Really, loving your neighbor as yourself just doesn’t matter to an atheist.
- fundianna jones
  December 1, 2011
  Reply
  I agree with everything you just said Richard.
  Richard said:
  “Really, loving your neighbor as yourself just doesn’t matter to an atheist.”
  You hit the nail on the head Richard. Loving your neighbor as yourself is from the Bible and we all know what the atheists think of the Bible.
  I think that atheists are only happy when they are making Christians unhappy and even then I don’t think they are even happy.
- BathTub
  December 1, 2011
  Reply
  And what does your moral grounding say about lying?
- Sonnie
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  I don’t understand your obsession with Richard either. Perhaps you know deep down that he is telling you the truth.
  Keep up the good work Richard.
- Nohm
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  Sonnie,
  You’ve missed a lot of back-and-forth between some of us and Richard, which I think would better explain why Jim is interested (not “obsessed”) with Richard’s responses.
  Please don’t jump to conclusions before knowing what you’re talking about.
- Sonnie
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  Nohm,
  Aren’t you jumping to a conclusion about me with what you just wrote?
  I think Richard is entitled to his opinion and I don’t see how he is making anything up.
- theB1ackSwan
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  What conclusion is he jumping to, exactly?
- Nohm
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  Sonnie,
  No, I’m not jumping to a conclusion because if you said “I don’t see how he is making anything up” after I pointed out that you’ve missed a lot of back-and-forth between some of us and Richard (look back through recent posts here at Steve’s blog), then my statement stands that you’re jumping to conclusions before knowing what you’re talking about.
  You were also jumping to a conclusion by suggesting that Jim had an “obsession with Richard”.
Nohm
December 1, 2011
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Richard wrote:
“Do atheists have a moral grounding?”
Unless they’re nihilists (which is different than an atheist, although there are people who are both), yes, atheists have a moral grounding.
If they didn’t, you’d think that maybe they’d be drastically higher-represented in prisons and such.
“If there is no God, as atheists contend,”
No, Richard. What atheists contend is this: “we don’t believe your unsupported claims of a deity.”
“what difference does it make if Christians want to: meet, to give thanks, break bread, share what God is doing in their lives and read the Bible.”
Except for meeting, I don’t think atheists have an issue with any of those things. The problem with the meeting is that when it’s done in a residential area, and we’re talking about 50 cars, then you’re going to annoy your neighbors, regardless of the purpose of the gathering. If you have 50 people showing up for a Tupperware party once a week, I think you’d get the same complaints.
Put yourself in someone else’s shoes, please.
“Really, why should an atheist care what happens?”
Because some of us don’t want Grandma driving around for an hour looking for a parking spot within a mile of our houses.
“If atheism is right, then in the end it just doesn’t matter.”
I disagree. Thankfully, you’re not an atheist. Why should it not matter?
“It would seem to me that the atheist’s mantra should be “Live for today for tomorrow we die.””
It would seem to me that you don’t know what you’re talking about, Richard. Why does it seem to you that that should be an atheist’s mantra? It’s absurd.
Richard, please understand that atheists are not necessarily nihilists and vice versa. It seems that many people on Steve’s blog confuse the two, and — given that I’m both not a nihilist and that I view such philosophy as immature — it offends me.
“Seems to me”
I hope that, at some point in your life, reality gives you a wake-up call that what “seems to you” about people you don’t understand is almost always wrong.
“that the atheists should be the happiest people on earth because they know better than to get upset about a few 50 cars parking in the neighborhood once every weekday night.”
Are you suggesting that such a thing wouldn’t bother you? I doubt it.
“Really, loving your neighbor as yourself just doesn’t matter to an atheist.”
Says who? You? Thank goodness again you’re not an atheist.
Loving your neighbor as yourself has just as much meaning to an atheist as it does to a Christian. For example, my way of showing love to my neighbors is to not make stuff up.
- Sonnie
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  That is a good question. My opinion is that a lot of the atheists that come in here don’t have much of a social life, which opens up a lot of free time for them.
  I think it is funny that it appears that some atheists are so obsessed with Richard and his opinions that they must spend hours analyzing every word he writes and then even more time formulating a rebuttal.
  Richard, and Steve, I hope one day some of these people actually get past arguing with you and see that you are trying to help them see the truth.
  God bless.
- theB1ackSwan
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  Why *wouldn’t* we have a social life? Aren’t we the ones who are obsessed about “worldly” things?
- Nohm
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  Sonnie wrote:
  “That is a good question. My opinion is that a lot of the atheists that come in here don’t have much of a social life, which opens up a lot of free time for them.”
  Well, at least for me, your opinion is wrong. It doesn’t take me as long as you might think to write up my comments; I type very quickly.
  I also mostly write up my comments at work while I’m waiting for a drop-off on a project, so it doesn’t affect my social life at all.
  “I think it is funny that it appears that some atheists are so obsessed with Richard”
  Again you go with this “obsession” thing. Seriously Sonnie, look back at recent conversations we’ve had with Richard, and you’ll understand what we’re referring to. You’re talking about something that you don’t have knowledge of.
  “and his opinions that they must spend hours analyzing every word he writes and then even more time formulating a rebuttal.”
  1. It’s not his opinions that bother us, it’s his truth claims. There’s a vast difference.
  2. Seriously, it does not take that long to formulate and write a rebuttal. It might for you, I don’t know, but it doesn’t for me.
  “Richard, and Steve, I hope one day some of these people actually get past arguing with you and see that you are trying to help them see the truth.”
  Sonnie, do you have any interest in why some of us might be arguing with Richard? There is a valid reason, just so you know.
  As for helping us see the truth… well, do you think that the best way to help someone see the truth is by making stuff up?
  I don’t. I think it’s by presenting an explanation that is persuasive to the intended audience.
- Nohm
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  Sonnie,
  Did you somehow miss statements by Richard where he stated “Really, loving your neighbor as yourself just doesn’t matter to an atheist.“?
  Do you not understand why some of us atheists would find that highly offensive, not just because he’s doing failed mind-reading, but because it’s just an offensive statement?
  He didn’t say “my opinion is…”, he stated “Really, loving your neighbor as yourself just doesn’t matter to an atheist.“
- Sonnie
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  Nohm: Sonnie, do you have any interest in why some of us might be arguing with Richard? There is a valid reason, just so you know.
  To Nohm: Sure. If you want to explain your reasons. You don’t have to though. It seems to me that Richard is expressing his opinions.
  Nohm: Sonnie,
  Did you somehow miss statements by Richard where he stated “Really, loving your neighbor as yourself just doesn’t matter to an atheist.“?
  To Nohm and Jim: Richard’s comment seems to me to be an expression of his opinion. I don’t know how his comment is making anything up if that is indeed what he thinks.
  I’m also not seeing how his comment should cause anyone to be offended given that “loving your neighbor as yourself” is primarily a Judeo-Christian idea and Biblical imperative and if atheists don’t follow the Bible then most likely they don’t really care about Biblical imperatives.
  I’m not sure if someone needs to preface “this is my opinion” for other people to understand that the speaker is expressing an opinion.
- Garrett Gero
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  Sonnie, why are you so obsessed with us? You must not have much of a social life if you keep coming back here.
Quasar
December 1, 2011
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“Seems to me that the atheists should be the happiest people on earth because they know better than to get upset about a few 50 cars parking in the neighborhood once every weekday night.”
Dear Occupy Wall Street,
If you could do us a favor, we’d appreciate it if you could see your way to occupying Richard Chavarria’s neighbourhood. Those of you who can afford cars, please drive. Afterall, he knews better than to get upset about a few hundred people parking in the neighbourhood once in a while.
Thanks,
Evil Atheist Conspiricy
- theB1ackSwan
  December 2, 2011
  Reply
  Absolutely love it.
  - phil
    December 3, 2011
    
    I love that idea too. I’m sure Richard wouldn’t lose an opportunity to witness to the lost proclaiming the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
    I would love to see a banner saying “Repent and Occupy the Gospel1”
  - theB1ackSwan
    December 5, 2011
    
    I’ll assume you ignored the point on purpose..
phil
December 3, 2011
Reply
On second thought, I would love to see someone make a banner saying “Repent, Believe the Gospel and Occupy Heaven!”